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00:00 - 15:0015:00 - 23:00

3:09 PM
Having the 'o' moved to the other side of the keyboard really killed it for me. :|
 
How did you attempt to learn?
 
@RebeccaChernoff I set up the layout, printed it out and started typing.
I rarely look at the keyboard anyway.
I think I may have a better chance with vanilla DVORAK (I tried Programmmers' DVORAK)
4 hours ago, by radp
user image
at least it doesn't rearrange numbers in that quasirandom way.
 
Yeah, I use regular dvorak. I've thought about moving to that or there is also Developer's Dvorak, but eh.
For regular Dvorak, this is what I used. Ridiculously simple, but it worked.
 
I see the layouts aren't that different however
so 98% of the frustration I had today would've been kept intact had I used the "real" thing
 
At the root of things, Dvorak is Dvorak.
@radp, 98% of the frustration was you jumped in without learning it.
 
3:20 PM
@RebeccaChernoff It's not like I learned QWERTY.
 
Do you expect to go to Germany without knowing German and instantly be able to converse in German?
Anyways, my strong suggestion would be to do the ABCD course. You'll be fine.
<3 Dvorak
I force myself to use qwerty a bit each day so that I can still decently type with it, and it just feels so clumsy.
 
The middle row made a lot of sense while I typed with it
but that 'o' always got the best of me
somehow, second position middle row is the last place I'd try for it
 
Nothing is where you expect it. That's why you have to learn it.
You're breaking a habit.
 
...except for 'a' and 'm'
 
You have to expect that will take a bit.
No, those aren't where you expect either because you expect everything to be different. (;
 
3:24 PM
My point stands, and it helped me loads :)
 
You did learn it though.
You didn't just sit down at the computer one day and instantly you knew the qwerty layout fluently.
 
So, where's that webpage to report a site for malware?
There's an email for trademark misuse, one page to report AdWords infractions, one page to report spam, ...
...and another page for malware, sigh.
 
4:26 PM
uh, so 7531902468 was part of the original layout
 
4:43 PM
@RebeccaChernoff I dunno, that's how it happened for me.
yawns G'morning everyone :P
 
@TimStone Heh.
 
If you were planning to buy Mindcrac-- er I meant Minecraft
the clock is ticking!
On the 20th the beta is released, the price goes up to €15 and the "all future updates are free" promise no longer holds.
 
5:01 PM
@RebeccaChernoff So, how much did you get done while babysitting?
@radp :O
Oh cool, I'm just the kind of person the FCC is looking for!
 
5:15 PM
@TimStone Umm, errr, uhhhh, tons!
 
Heheh, TGIWF! ;)
 
So on two out of two computers I tried Unity on
hovering the side bar crashes Unity (or is it Mutter)
...wtf?
 
What is hovering the side bar supposed to do?
 
5:30 PM
It's like hovering the Windows start bar.
At best it does some visual gimmicks.
Apparently Mutter is just an unstable piece of crap however.
 
It would seem that way, heh.
 
The guys on AskUbuntu tell me that the 11.04 version of Unity, based on Compiz, is far stabler.
 
I don't like how adding labels to issues hides the title on Github. ):
 
@RebeccaChernoff Yeah. :( Heheh, maybe we need a GitHub userscript too :p
 
5:35 PM
The text is still there, you just can't see it.
Seems like kind of a blatant design flaw though, wonder why they haven't tried to fix that.
@radp Heh, that keyboard position question was interesting....I feel like I just instinctively "know" where to put my hand now to press the right keys...
 
@TimStone It took me a couple of minutes to write the comment where I tell the asker he's accepted the wrong answer.
 
Keyboard position question?
 
1
Q: What to use to identify keys without looking?

Brian OjedaAll to often I hit one of the hot keys that surounds the movement keys. This a big problem in World of Warcraft when flying high on mount and hitting any action key that causes the toon to unmount. So, what are good things to use to help identify keys with out looking down at the keys? I want t...

 
Asker: «So, what are good things to use to help identify keys with out looking down at the keys? I want to be able to identify the standard WASD movement keys without looking.»
Accepted answer: use ESDF instead
...
 
....Yeaaaah.
I don't really understand his reasoning either.
 
5:45 PM
., o, e, u q:
 
Backward smilies, backward keyboards..Where will the madness end? :P
 
Dvorak > Qwerty, sorry. (:
 
I am thoroughly unconvinced. ;) However, I am convinced that drinking a soda was a terrible idea, as now my stomach hates me for introducing such acidic goodness.
 
Heh.
In other news, slow typists annoy me. (;
 
Hahah, why's that? :P
 
5:57 PM
Because they take forever to type something!
 
Well sure, but I assume there's some context for this complaint.
 
No, just my random mind connecting keyboard layouts with typing speed hehe.
 
Ah, so you're really saying that we're all slow typists, I see how it is. ;)
 
Heh. I have no idea how fast you type. (;
 
We'll just assume it's super speedy then.
 
6:01 PM
Works for me!
 
\o/
I suppose I should get that userscript business sorted out today and then add the few things I wanted to add to the chat script...after I get real work done, heh.
 
6:14 PM
I think the real problem of Maths is this "us MathOverflow vs you StackOverflow" feeling
It feels as if people just want a MathOverflow site running on the new software full stop, and don't give a rat's ass about all the rest
status-plz-to-gief-teh-feature
 
They have bigger degrees than us, so they're more special.
 
@TimStone It's not even that, it's just... Area51 and SE 2.0 is about forming new communities, rather than migrating existing ones.
Many believed Math.SE to be a new community, but 4/5 moderator candidates come from MO.
and I'm not even sure about the fifth.
 
I still don't see why there's anything more than a behavioural barrier getting in the way of adapting an existing community.
And if that's all there is...well.
 
6:29 PM
Are people still going on about the comments and new lines and return key? |:
 
I'm not sure, I've opted to avoid the community altogether based on the strife that I've seen pouring out of it.
 
@TimStone It's simple, people get in denial whenever SE 1.0 and SE 2.0 differ
and refuse to accept the reasons for the difference
or refuse to believe there is a reason in the first place
"Your users hate this so take it off!"
 
@radp Right, which of course is a behavioural issue.
 
@TimStone Oh, yeah, well, it's a bunch of human beings we're talking about, so the behavioral component is the whole point.
Apparently there's no gold badge for "Converted: Accepted StackExchange has changed in the last 2 years and understood not all changes happened just because."
 
6:39 PM
Naturally. I just thought that most people realized that playing the role of the kicking and screaming child really wasn't an effective approach. ;)
I'm used to things descending into argument, but everything there seems to start out that way.
 
You'd be surprised by the power of 500 kicking and screaming children.
2
 
If nothing else, making it very difficult to tell if there's a legitimate point to be made at the root of it all.
(I take that back, since that's extending the implied behaviour to far more people than deserve it)
@RebeccaChernoff Ah, I was wondering why there was so much activity in the JavaScript room on a Saturday :P
 
Yeah..
 
I could just ignore, but that's just sweeping it under the rug, not dealing with it.
 
6:47 PM
@radp I guess the real question is why there's so much resentment towards adaption in such an isolated space. Weren't there other SE 1.0 sites that dissolved and became part of new SE 2.0 proposals? Likewise, surely not everything on SE 2.0 corresponds with the "internet at large", so everyone is subject to some level of change..yet, for the most part, things are peaceful.
 
And I don't think I've ever actually resorted to ignoring someone on irc, no need to start now.
 
@RebeccaChernoff Yeah, that's true. I was actually curious how Nick and Andy E felt about it, given that they own the room.
 
7:06 PM
'Ello @PopularDemand, @drachenstern
 
@TimStone Hi there. I'm struggling to figure out what you guys are talking about. Also the topics that will be on my final exam.
Don't, uh, jump all over each other to offer explanations, or anything.
 
Ok, I won't. (:
 
@PopularDemand You'd probably not consider yourself missing out on either topic, heh. The real trick is to avoid getting what we're talking about confused with what will be on your final exam, since that could go horribly wrong.
 
I was talking about a bot that is running in the JavaScript room on SO. I agree with @TimStone. You're not missing much.
It spits out such drivel as this:
in JavaScript on Stack Overflow Chat, 41 mins ago, by Coding Kitten
@IvoWetzel Do solutions always sound smarter you work again? joined the !
 
/blames @YiJiang
 
7:12 PM
"5) Prove that the problem [definition here] is NP-complete."
"Well, according to R. Chernoff (2010), a robotic conversation program located at..."
 
Hahaha.
A+!
 
If you get stuck, just write down "Oy!" That's instant bonus points right there.
Assuming that stars correlate to your test scores. Which they do.
Oh, @RebeccaChernoff...I may have asked this before, but I'm not sure if I got an answer, and it's severely hampering my desire to switch from Firefox to Chrome.
How the hell do I open local files without having to type a nonsense file:/// URL in?
 
@TimStone Turn your machine into a webserver.
 
Or are they so adamant about this whole web business that they refuse to add that?
 
@TimStone I just do ctrl+o and then type in the path. Not sure if there's another/better way.
 
7:17 PM
@RebeccaChernoff Oh wow, total disregard for keyboard shortcuts for the fail.
That'll work.
I just couldn't find a menu option for it.
@PopularDemand Hah :P
 
Yeah, the reason I wanted it as for loading up the userscripts, heheh.
 
I installed it once and now just open the actual extension file from the google appdata folder. Easy to just disable/enable to refresh changes. Then I'll copy that into my github project folder when I'm ready to commit.
Somewhat annoying, but eh.
 
Here we go. All of my problems are solved:
See: Chernoff, R, and T Stone. "Oy!." Proceedings of Meta Stack Overflow Chat 1.7 (2010): n. pag. The Tavern. Web. 11 Dec. 2010.
 
Ah, I do the reverse, heheh. :P
@PopularDemand I'll consider myself an authority on whatever the subject of the test is for your benefit, sure.
 
7:23 PM
Now, back to wasting time!
3
 
@PopularDemand I also consider myself an authority in that subject as well, should you need additional guidance.
 
@TimStone I'm afraid that I'm currently being productive. How can I verify this, and if it is true, what should I do about it?
 
The fact that you're trying to figure this out is itself a bad sign, I'm afraid. :(
 
@TimStone Oh, no! Is there a cure?
 
7:30 PM
Unfortunately, my lack of productivity has made it nearly impossible to work on one..
 
We need to create a tag that can be used on all questions dealing with answerspcie, commonansewr, weaks, &c. (misspellings intentional).
They're not exactly content thieves. They could be using the data dumps, so they're not necessarily screen scrapers.
 
[effortless-bastards]
 
They don't have the same format, so I'm not thrilled with the term "clones."
 
[sites-ranked-higher-on-google]
 
@RebeccaChernoff True for certain questions, but not universally.
 
7:39 PM
I wasn't exactly being serious. q:
 
I know.
 
[copy-cats]?
 
That could work.
Tag [copycat-sites] created!
 
SAXTransformerFactory factory = (SAXTransformerFactory)SAXTransformerFactory.newInstance(); shakes head
 
@TimStone What? How're you going to know what kind of object gets returned if you don't explicitly cast? It could be anything!
 
7:51 PM
@PopularDemand Well, that's my code...because you do have to cast.
Because .newInstance() returns a TransformerFactory
Since, you know..
That makes sense.
Even though there are a ton of methods that are specific to SAXTransformerFactory that you might want access to.
 
... I'm taking you out of my exam citation.
2
 
Hahah
 
Okay, back to focusing on work.
 
8:12 PM
Oh what the hell Eclipse. fumes
 
@PopularDemand Enjoy the badge. q:
 
Morning All
 
g'afternoon. (:
 
'Ello
 
8:36 PM
grumbles and goes off to make food
 
8:47 PM
tears slice of pizza, cheers
 
9:05 PM
returns
 
9:16 PM
shudders
 
\o/ keyboard shortcut userscript has scrolling now!
 
@RebeccaChernoff Hooray!
You wanna fix Eclipse for me now? :P
 
Erm.
Um.
What's wrong with it? |:
 
There's a bug in their compiler that's telling me that my code is wrong when it isn't....Which admittedly sounds like I'm joking, but is totally true. :P
 
Are you sure it isn't a PEBKAC? (;
VS sometimes yells at code that is correct. Restarting it usually fixes that though.
 
9:28 PM
Let's see if that'll work. I suspect not, because of the error.
 
Hmm, decisions decisions. Help overlay for ? shortcut or doing the main /questions functionality...
 
Second one ;)
 
Did you want to think about that for a bit?
hehehe
 
Unfortunately restarting Eclipse didn't work :(
I stand by my decisions! ;)
 
Ok, so for the questions listing, is anything besides { j=down, k=up, enter=go } needed?
 
9:32 PM
Hm, don't imagine so. There's not really that much else on the page.
 
The navigation for the header stuff is separate, global to both /questions and /questions/{id}
 
whines There doesn't appear to be a way to tell Eclipse to STFU about this error either, bleh. :(
 
You're positive it isn't you?
 
100%
It's upset that a instance variable marked final may not be initialized, but the only way for it not to be initialized is if an exception is thrown, and that exception prevents the creation of the object. There are two other similar final variables before this that do the same thing, and it doesn't have a problem with them (presumably because they throw the same exception). javac (the "real" compiler) has no problems with the code in mock-up test case form either, so.
HAH
OK, you were right. :P
 
...
PEBKAC claims another victim?
 
9:46 PM
Heheh, as much as I hate to admit it, yeah.
Normally I blame myself first, but this time I was really confused.
Apparently I forgot about the return statements a la guard clauses that could potentially have been fired earlier on, since I was thinking the problem was coming from a different source.
So, totally my bad, and now fixed.
 
@RebeccaChernoff Aren't you, uh, optimistic?
 
o:
I try to be, but ummm confused
 
You're assuming that the new tag will be used on sufficient (what is it, 50?) questions to award me a badge.
Or, I've misinterpreted your meaning.
 
Hm. I guess I felt like there were probably 50 questions you could retag now. Heh.
 
@RebeccaChernoff Maybe there are. I stopped with the three on the main page, though. Although I just edited the title of my "report copiers here" question and added the tag to that, too. So, uh, 8% of the way there, yay!
 
9:55 PM
\o/
 
shakes head at how much time that wasted
 
10:37 PM
shudders
 
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