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7:00 PM
@PopularDemand China
 
@PopularDemand Earth
 
More specifically, Lijiang.
 
@TimStone that is a city ... right?
 
@Chacha102 Pics or it didn't happen.
 
Yes
:For the river in Guangxi Province, see Lijiang River. Other uses see Lijiang and Old Town of Lijiang. Lijiang () is a prefecture-level city in the northwest of Yunnan Province, China. It has an area of and a population of 1,137,600 as of 2005. History Lijiang City replaced former administrative region Lijiang Prefecture. Lijiang Prefecture no longer exists today. It was under the rule of the Mu family (木氏) local commanders (土司) during the Ming Dynasty and Qing Dynasty. Administrative divisions The government of Lijiang City sits in Gucheng District. Lijiang City comprises one distri...
 
7:04 PM
just checking...
 
@Chacha102 Have you ever used that keyboard display?
 
sometimes...
 
o_o
 
I really need to set it to display the time, always
 
You should port SO Live! to that thingy. Then you'd never be able to look away.
 
7:10 PM
that would actually be useful
what is SO Live!
 
you have an actual honest-to-goodness clock right there
why do you need a clock on your keyboard too?
 
right where?
 
13
Q: SO Live! -- live updates to your reputation score.

badpScreenshot About This userscript, based on SOApi.js, injects itself in all SE pages and polls the API for reputation changes every 60 seconds. When your reputation changes, this is quietly announced at the top of the page and the top reputation counter is joyfully updated. The notification ...

 
oh, thats an older picture
I got rid of that clock
it didn't work..
 
"When your reputation changes, this is quietly announced at the top of the page and the top reputation counter is joyfully updated above where you rep really is."
(;
 
7:19 PM
status-norepro
Third time you complain about that, but if I can't repro or see where the problem is, I can't help you :(
 
status-get-2-votes-within-a-minute
3
 
@rchern That's cheating!
 
seriously though. you need to get 2 votes within a minute, but one before SOLive checks, and one after.
 
Besides, it's ought to have nothing to do with it.
 
why?
didn't we look at this?
the from timestamp is not accurate, it repeats itself right?
 
7:21 PM
Yeah, and failed to find the issue.
@rchern um, no, the from timestamps never repeat from that "dump" you looked at
 
?
I didn't totally pay attention to what @YiJiang was saying. But the timestamps vs callbacks vs whatever weren't lining up?
Anytime I get votes within a minute of each other I see duplicated info.
'tisn't a one time thing.
 
← is trying to dig up last time's logs
 
The only solution is for me to install the script and then for you people to up vote me so I can debug.
nods
 
I wondered when someone would do that hehehe
Took longer than I expected!
would guess that downvotes demonstrate the issue just the same. q:
 
Clearly I'm only doing it as a last ditch effort, of course ;)
 
7:26 PM
Nov 20 at 16:50, by rchern
1290271500, 1290271560, 1290271620, 1290271680, 1290271740
↑ from timestamps not repeating themselves
 
Ok. Issue still presents itself though.
 
That said, there are a lot of rep-changing actions that do not show up in that API route
for example: downvotes casted, accepted answers removed, votes changed
 
Right. So every time I get a couple votes I also get a retracted vote?
I've noticed this since installing the script and didn't report it because I thought that.
 
@rchern I'm not saying that, I'm saying that the script is working with incomplete data to begin with :(
 
But since it happens with regularity....meh.
 
7:27 PM
I'm happy that I'm 102 points from 3k, I should do something about that tonight :D
 
does SO Live! Chat have the same repeating problem?
 
Yes, I see duplicated notifications here too. I mentioned that last time.
 
I see you did.
 
(:
 
I...
I think I can imagine what the issue is
 
7:30 PM
That's what you said last time!
 
But I got a different idea
One that'd let me /blame API :P
I mean, if I was doing something wrong with the timestamps, you'd see duplicated events every single time.
All I can think of is that the API is the one reporting a "duplicate event" (a +20 where it really is +10).
 
Wow. StackFlair is #8.
 
It isn't, though.
Thus, I must be handling time stamps correctly, if the bug truly is that systematic.
 
I recognize it needs to be tested more.
I'm just not sure how.
Since it relies on getting upvotes in quick succession.
 
Would it happen if you received downvotes in quick succession?
How about -100 penalties?
 
7:41 PM
I would presume so, but I don't know.
 
yep, more testing is required!! :-}
 
Upvotes and accepts are part of it.
@TimStone volunteered. starts flagging @TimStone as spam
 
Okay, I'll do this. I get you a version of SO Live chat that dumps data about each update to the console
 
@radp Doesn't your script make the mistake of believing that the server's clock is the same as the user's?
 
@TimStone SO Api should abstract from that.
 
7:44 PM
How?
You haven't set a to time, so it's possible to get the same event twice if the server is too far ahead.
 
Soapi.RouteFactory("api.stackoverflow.com", "key")
.Questions({
    // no unix timestamps here! ←
    fromdate: "1 Jun 2010 00:00:00", // use a string
    todate: new Date("1 Jun 2010 12:00:00"), // or use a Date. up to you.
    sort: "creation",
    pagesize: 10
})
I use a Date
Besides my computer is not on UTC
@TimStone If this was the problem, since rchern is six hours behind UTC, she'd get duplicate notifications for 6 hours straight, always.
 
No, I'm saying if the server's actual time is a minute ahead.
 
@TimStone Again, she'd get duplicate notifications, always.
 
Why?
 
Although you do raise a good point (about the client's time being behind. I trust SO to use NTP.)
7 mins ago, by radp
user image
If all checks overlap, then all events are duplicated.
There's no way around it.
Since only some do, that's not the case.
 
7:47 PM
I'm also not sure if within the minute, if the rep needs to be on the same post or if any post will do.
 
I'll look into adding a to just in case.
 
I feel like mine have always been on the same.
 

Awake, my sleeping beauty; awake.

4 mins ago, 17 seconds total – 2 messages, 2 users, 1 star

Bookmarked 4 secs ago by badp

 
q:
 
8:03 PM
Assuming an interval of five seconds and an offset of seven seconds:

Server 07 ---- 12 ---- 17
             A    B
Client 00 ---- 05 ---- 10

- A request at Client 05 would return A
- A request at Client 10 would return A and B

Server 07 ---- 12 ---- 17
           A      B
Client 00 ---- 05 ---- 10

- A request at Client 05 would return A
- A request at Client 10 would return B
Right? Or did I mess something up? :P
 
Someone please remind me how to make tags here.
 
[tags here]
 
that-s it?
[me-idiot]
no
 
Ignore me
 
not working
 
8:11 PM
[status-pay-rchern-5-dollars-and-then-you-will-find-the-wisdom-you-seek]
 
status-me-idiot
 
status-must-be-first
 
ah
status-rchern-no
 
Is anyone else seeing two avatars for Moshe?
 
status-laughing
 
8:11 PM
@PopularDemand erm?
 
status-no
 
@PopularDemand Don't seem to be.
 
status-although-i-dont-mind-being-two
status-two-is-better-than-one
 
I think that's enough. :)
 
After the change to the shirt collar avatar, I commented that I was still seeing the old identicon for large avatars. I figured it'd resolve itself after a while, but it hasn't.
 
8:13 PM
Okay.
 
@PopularDemand Really? Weird...I haven't had that issue.
 
@PopularDemand - have you cleared your cache?
 
@Moshe Multiple times.
 
oh
 
8:14 PM
status-one-is-the-loneliest-number-you-will-ever-know
 
It happens on multiple computers, anyways.
 
Load this in your browser and if it shows the identicon, do a hard-refresh?
 
Victory is @rchern's!
 
Heh.
 
hard-refresh?
 
8:23 PM
@Moshe There's a great SO answer about this, hold on a sec....
144
A: What requests do browsers' "F5" and "Ctrl + F5" refreshes generate?

someIt is up to the browser but they behave in similar ways. I have tested FF, IE7, Opera and Chrome. F5 usually updates the page only if it is modified. The browser usually tries to use all types of cache as much as possible and adds an "If-modified-since" header to the request. Opera differs by s...

Really is a beautiful piece of work.
 
Yes, but the interesting thing is that you said you cleared your cache and that didn't help?
 
@PopularDemand It is, heh
 
@rchern Yes. And the fact that it happened on two machines in two totally different places.
 
yet doing a hard refresh fixed it?
|:
 
@TimStone Re your first example. Remove B. You still get A twice.
The issue only happens with both A and B.
 
8:30 PM
Oh, fair enough.
We know that for certain?
 
@TimStone @rchern has been pretty clear on this.
 
Relatively mostly certain?
2
Heh.
 
I guess if it's common enough for her to at least think that's the only case it happens in then it's likely due to that particular case. So, I'll admit I'm wrong. :P
 
We need a SO sandbox.
 
@rchern dev.meta.stackoverflow.com
I'm sure you have a password you can leak to us.
2
 
8:34 PM
Oy.
5
 
Where's the star police?
2
 
8:47 PM
 
9:46 PM
Hmm
 
Rainbows
 
10:20 PM
oh snap, I think I have all the changes in place that were due last wednesday! hurry hurry somebody grab the tip and tag it! ;)
calls attention to the fact that he's been behind and that he realizes it's not a good thing ;)
 
@drachenstern I bet I have a job for R#, I just don't know how to use it.
 
lol, yeah I've found that many times while using R#
loves to listen to his HDD whirl ... "not normal" you say? hmmm...
 
10:47 PM
(first time chatter, longtime lurker) I had a question about an Area 51 proposal I created
 
LIES!
You were here last night weren't you?
(;
 
ok
yes, that was technically my first time chatting
but basically no one was here
 
Sorry, I couldn't resist. (;
 
sorry
anyway, I have been happy with the modest but steady increase in growth at the proposal. However, I wanted to know if a couple of you more experienced SE users would follow with us as well?
74
Dermatology and Dermatopathology

Proposed Q&A site for expert dermatologist and dermatopathologists

Currently in definition.

 
I have 0 expertise in this area.
 
10:50 PM
I think with all the new users it would be good to have a couple more experience people to simply guide newcomers with regard to how to actually use SE
I realize that probably none of you are derm experts
but you are SE experts
 
I'm stunningly inactive in here lately. To the casual observer, it would appear I'm actually getting work done during the day
 
Thoughts?
 
@rchern yer gonna scare 'em ;)
 
@user152426 You're probably not going to get many people willing to spend a lot of time on a site they're not interested in and know nothing about, regardless of overall SE experience
All they can really do is watch people and occasionally comment with "pro tip: you can do X here!"
 
@user152426 My personal subjective highly inflammatory thoughts are these: We're not likely to be the core constituency there, we're not gonna be good contributors, and the site is fairly accessible (in my limited experience throwing friends and family at the sites) to most non-users, if they'll take two moments and open their eyes wider than the blinders allow.
 
10:56 PM
@MichaelMrozek so how do I get more experienced users involved to get the proposal through the commitment stage?
 
if they refuse to see past the blinders, then no great number of us can do anything about it
@user152426 You evangelize all over the network, visiting as many chatrooms and being as much of a buzz-nuisance as you feel is necessary. Don't overlook the chat.stackexchange rooms
however, that tactic is only going to get you so far. My alternative advice is this: Go be a moderator on [insert-SE-name-here].stackexchange.com
Then come back and explain to the rest of the world why they should do the same for your pet site ...
sounds horrible but it's the truth, that's what it'll take
 
I personally don't think reciprocity is going to work well. "Hey guys, I was active on site X, so you should all be active on my site Y in exchange" is silly. People interested in dermatology will be active on dermitology.SE; people that aren't, won't
 
@MichaelMrozek hence my recommendation to go become a moderator on one of those sites ;)
 
Hopefully you can find some people both interested in dermatology and already active on SE sites
 
it takes a lot of work to get to that point
people vest a lot of interest in their "home site"
wouldn't you agree @rchern ?
 
10:59 PM
I am currently doing an automated-ish e-mail campaign to bring in expert dermatologists and dermatopathologists, which is where most of the followers are from. However, yeah, I really want to find more people with high reps to be interested and follow the proposal so it makes it through commitment
 
@drachenstern Aaand they just sold themselves a copy.
 
@mootinator lol, did it take you all of 30 minutes to decide that?
 
@user152426 You don't want it to make it through commitment and then have a 10% fulfilled commitment rate though
 
that's a good point
 
@MichaelMrozek bingo
 
11:01 PM
@drachenstern I had to figure out what the heck I was doing, but yes.
I can think of hours and hours the structural search and replace would have saved me already :P
 
so lets say 90% of followers are new (i.e. rep of 50ish), how many does it take to get through the commitment stage?
 
@mootinator and now, you'll wonder how you ever used VS before ... much like my moving to 1080 makes me wonder how I ever used a non-HD monitor in my life
ok all, sorry to chat n run, but I'm expected to leave the office about 15 minutes ago
ttyl
 
The final commitment percentage of a proposal is equal to the MINIMUM of these three numbers:

Total Commitment Score (above) / 500
Total # of committers / 200
Total # of committers with 200+ rep on a single site / 100
(Users with less than 200 total rep have a "commitment score" of 1.5)
 
or not, broken code grrrr
 
so can we take for example
163
Persian Information Technology and Computer

Proposed Q&A site for persian IT and Computer users (from Beginners to Experts). اطلاعات بیشتر (لطفاً حتماً مطالعه کنید): http://danatarin.com

Currently in commitment.

 
11:06 PM
@drachenstern So when you said you had it working earlier, you lied. I feel deceived. :(
 
why is this at 8%?
 
@TimStone but it worked "on my box"!!!
 
@drachenstern Ah ha. :P
 
that particular broken piece was a null in the database ... a SEP I believe
I can handily code around it with a simple ISNULL
 
@user152426 Oh, my mistake, it's not 200 total rep, it's 200 rep on a single site. Probably there are only 8 committed users with 200 rep on a single site, and that's the lowest of the three criteria
So you're right, you do need rather a lot of 200 rep users (100) before commitment can finish. That's kind of unfortunate
 
11:10 PM
however 200 rep isn't that incredibly high, it's just a lot of users ... unfortunately this is one of the drawbacks to the SE methodology...
 
ok
now how many referrals does a new user have to get inorder to reach 200?
 
I'm not sure if area 51 rep counts as a site
 
Basically, when a potential user gets an e-mail from me I tell them to (1) follow the proposal, and (2) vote. However, I want to know if I should add a (3) refer X number of your colleagues. I think #3 is tough to get people to do, but if that request will ensure a successful proposal I can try
 
11:34 PM
ok
well, perhaps I could change directions
I have a challenge for all of you
especially rchern
 
I have to ask...What is this challenge?
 
so I am just a little ol dermatologist who likes to program as a hobby
I have a person site I created a month or two ago, and I hide three easter eggs on it
only one person has been able to find one of them, and that was with a huge hint
do any of you think you can do better?
person=personal
 
That's...kind of obscure. But I'm sure someone will try if you give us the link.
 
also, if you have any other feedback about the site, I am always looking to make improvements
 
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